so many trials, so little time

A very important editorial in Al-Akhbar today by Joseph Samaha calling for a judicial hearing of Lebanese Minister of Defense Ahmad Fatfat on the events that occured in Marjayoun during the Israeli invasion (which is still continuing by the way despite the cease-fire). Samaha argues that if Israel is going to the root cause of erroneous policy-making by questioning its government and not just simply denouncing military incompetence or outright murderous adventures (like in Qana etc.) why wouldn’t we do the same? Instead of stopping the military official who welcomed the Israeli army in Marjayoun and who invited them for some tea, why not ask from where did this order come? With all the Israeli/US agents we have in Lebanon, do you seriously think that Hariri-employee-cum-minister-of-defense did not know about the Israelis approaching Marjayoun to take over the military base (that they always occupied when they were in Lebanon during their occupation of the south)?

Right now the 14th of march dudes should really keep a low profile instead of barking non-sense as we saw Hariri, Jumblatt and Geagea do yesterday (to name a just a few).

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13 thoughts on “so many trials, so little time

  1. HI GUYS

    I KNOW NOTHING OF POLITICS

    ESPECIALLY LEBANESE POLITICS

    BUT I JUST SAW THE 17TH OF AUG. JUMBLATT’S SPEECH

    AT
    informationclearinghouse.info/article14611.htm

    AND I WOULD LIKE TO HAVE BECH’S IDEAS ON IT

    I DON’T SPEAK ARAB

    BUT I COULD SAY I HEARD

    A GOOD -AND VERY EDUCATED- SPEAKER

  2. Beshir…
    If you were in America, you d be categorised as a liberal!!
    American liberals see things very black and white…in fact they are the white of Bush’s black…Live and let live!!!
    the problem with that theory is the people that we let live are infringing on their part of the bargain.
    Someone has to take action!!
    hala2 this does not mean i support that whole preemptive strike shit!!!

    You are not looking at the big picture, I am one of those who supported the Israeli strikes on Hezbollah, however felt like they did not keep their promises (could have been much cleaner, but we discovered that they had very bad intel), makes me less patriotic, while Hezbollah truly is a proxy state for Iran in my country!!!
    I am not anti Shiite, but note that if any other sect (Muslims, Christians or Druze) took my country to war..I d be fucking pissed!!

    Imagine Texas declaring war on Mexico bcz too many immigrants are crossing the boarder….and the other states did not support their Lone Star State, makes them anti American…..you sound like a Texan to me!!
    Plz read the last section of Michael Young’s article (The somber dream of a garrison state) in today’s Daily star, might shed some light!!
    40 billion in debt, our GDP is less then half (first time our GDP stays in Lebanon..or we think, after the withdrawal of Syria),this war cost us another 6 billion and investors need to see another five years of relative peace, to even think of reinvesting….

    Bravo Nasralla, let me read the economics section in your shari3a, since mosque is before state!!!!!

    Think Besh, Analyse buddy..i had the same thought process as yours 3 years ago…..that might be why i sound a bit pushy..bass i hope you take this as an open dialog.
    Cheers.

  3. Diaspora: don’t mess with Texas.

    Bech: the 14th of March may be barking nonsense, but the 14th of August need their rabies shots.

  4. diaspora i see that you regressed in three years. it is painful to hear such phenomenon, but i know a lot of people like this. you really need to understand better the politics of the region, and especially what is Hezbollah, instead of stopping at stereotypes that you watch on fox news

    This sentence for example really does not mean anything, i’m really sorry to say this:
    Bravo Nasralla, let me read the economics section in your shari3a, since mosque is before state
    Actually not one single word put together with the very next word in this sentence means anything.

    Plz read the last section of Michael Young’s article (The somber dream of a garrison state) in today’s Daily star, might shed some light!!

    Do you know who Michael Young is?? if not then you need a 101 class in media politics.

    40 billion in debt, our GDP is less then half (first time our GDP stays in Lebanon..or we think, after the withdrawal of Syria)

    ha ha ha! you start to sound like a texan to me (Mexican are stealing jobs!) so you also need a review of how the economy of lebanon functioned during the last 15 years too.. who created the debt and why syria, hezbollah and all the other “demons” had nothing to do with it.

    I am not anti Shiite, but note that if any other sect (Muslims, Christians or Druze) took my country to war..I d be fucking pissed!!

    tell “buddy” where do you live exactly? because you’re really very racist.. who took you’re country to war? the “shiites”? what a bunch of little “jews” next door?

    You are not looking at the big picture, I am one of those who supported the Israeli strikes on Hezbollah, however felt like they did not keep their promises (could have been much cleaner, but we discovered that they had very bad intel), makes me less patriotic, while Hezbollah truly is a proxy state for Iran in my country

    what makes you patriotic? you favored Israeli strikes on your own country. Oh, sure why not? when they targeted one “useless” segments of the population without harming others (the supposed initial plan). First, there was never such plans, at least Israelis consider us all Lebanese, something Lebanese will never do! just stay in the US and praise your patriotism there. your “lebanism” for “others”. Sometimes i feel better to know that I’m not patriotic.

    Now, for all the Lebanese “diaspora” around the world, please refrain from posting non-sense on my blog, especially that I have other things to do than getting pissed at chauvinistic arguments.

  5. ayayaya!!!

    Dear Bechir:

    You assumed i labeled Hezbollah as a terrorist organisation just because i disagree with what they have done recently with your comments about the Fox news agency.
    Bravo Bech!! Mr Rupert Murdock will be very proud to hear about astute people like you, since you know that his news agency is the true right wing propagandist in the US and not the Cable News Network, since they have become arch enemies in recent years.

    Allow me then to correct you, and say
    no….. i do not believe Hezbollah is a terrorist organisation but rather a very important political player that i happen to disagree with, i think they should disarm and follow more political aspirations in the country. Rather then walking around intimidating other lebanese organisations with their armaments and warning them in case any civil war erupts, we got the guns which is justified in the name of defending Lebanon against Israel every time it suites them!!!a simple game called INTERNAL POWER POLITICS.

    Whether you agree or not dear abou el Bash. I beg of you not do dissect my text and elaborate it your way, you do not want to tamper with the integrity of the writers intent.
    Now please do explain to all of us around the world what is Khisbollah’s agenda. Just to head you in the right direction; We all know they are closely aligned with Syria and Iran….and if my memory is not playing tricks on me…i also believe that they mass rallied to keep Syria in Lebanon…Hmmmmmm
    what is their agenda people…i can’t quite nail it…. can anyone with Little bit of logic please elaborate…let us call Rami khouri!!!!
    well, i need to touch on other points, so dwell on the issue befor you respond.

    Mr astute abou el Bech bayk, do you know who Micheal young is??? OK freeze!!
    just for our western Friends: what my fellow countryman wanted to say is why do we say who Micheal young is, and not who is Micheal Young??
    Well, because Mr Micheal Young and Mr Thom Friedman(author of world is flat & from Beirut to jerusalem_which i believe was banned in Lebanon, and i may be wrong on that one) are stupidly stereotyped as (yehood) or Jew lovers, when they try to practice true journalism and call it like it is, whether pro X or anti Y, or vice versa, it went to the extend that they where labeled as spies if i recall, since every foreign journalist is a spy in our country according to unknown sources.
    ok Besh, tell us who is Micheal Young_correction_who Micheal Young is???
    (did you even look at his article in the daily star…i did not see any biases in this one….plz dissect the fucker so i can see it clearly)

    I did not see anything racist about what i said, if any sect took my country to war on their Sol and one directional belief, i would be pissed.
    let me rephrase then…regardless or any race, color, gender, religious belief, sexual orientation,bad hair due…if any of those FUCKS take my country to war i ll be pissed!!! welcome to debating politics in Lebanon…kiss ekhta_translation(fuck the sister of the situation).

    ok, last but not least.
    i did favor Israeli aggression on Hezbollah not my country,however, when i felt they where indiscriminate(including Shiites) in their attacks on the country, i believed they failed their purpose, so now i am stuck with the burden of supporting failed attacks on god’s militia in the eyes of my people, and Rab Rabbak will not change their mind, including Besh bayk.

    Now the least.
    I was not referring to Hezbollah or Syria as responsible for our dept, but as responsible for their reckless behavior towards our economical situation.
    yes, Hezbollah is a very honest organisation and maybe the least involved in the economical curtain of thieves, but if you do not think 6 billion is enough for hezbolla’s war budget then our economy is fine.
    people we r ok…we r ok..do not worry..nooooo thank you UEA, we do not want your money we are fine, weplaned for it in our budget for this year..tayeb we ll take a few mill…just bcz you insist….

    oh fuck it!!! you sound like you belong to a political group Bech,
    i am hpping you r not a greater damascuss guy!!
    could you tell me which one??? aya hezeb rayess??? or just a hippie!!!
    anyway you r herding with the rest o them.

  6. diaspora, you are a fruitcake. your logic is hard to follow. especially the part about hizbollah taking lebanon to war, you are drinking the koolaid

    You assumed i labeled Hezbollah as a terrorist organisation

    even your first sentence is a lie. it is perfectly clear why you would request
    I beg of you not do dissect my text

    everything you say sounds like the racist zionist paid blogging brigade.

  7. “and especially what is Hezbollah, instead of stopping at stereotypes that you watch on fox news”

    ok let us do what Besh does!!!
    WHAT IS THE FUCKING STEREOTYPE THAT HIEZBOLLA IS LABELED UNDER???
    AND WHAT THE FUCK DOES FOX NEWS CALL HEZBOLLAH???

    Anni zabreh…the militia’s streotype is a GHANDI like one, and fox’s segments on them is about ploking cotton to make ends meet……
    Anni, if you have a point to make or argue, go for it….if not….. shut the hell up!!!!

    i sound like a Zionist……Typical presumptions, if i dissagree, they assume i aprove with the total oposit….believe me i do the same to an ideology that favors israel……………Bech…reply rayess!!!…….or your DC spokesmen can do it for you

  8. Yeah it is Murr who is Minister of Defense and Fatfat Minister of Interior.

    I read the responsible of the Marjayoun caserne has been arrested immediately when the pics were released, although he was supported by the locals who argued he avoided a bloodbath. He did not get an order to stay and wait for the Israelis to come for a tea. He was stuck. Should he have send his men to death? Was he right to do what he did to spare lives? I am no one to judge although I have a preference for the presevation of life.

    What surprised me is the absolute silence on the killing of 16 Lebanese ‘spies’ by hezballah. They did not have a chance to defend themselves and where shot without being tried.

    I understand you being harsh with Murr but do we have to endorse all the extra-judicial actions perpetrated by Hezballah during the war? They are part of the government as much as Murr or Fatfat.

  9. Since do we give trials to spies? no nation in the history of the world have ever done this in a time of war. in any case, i’m not trying to defend anyone, it’s horrible to kill in any case. But the Marjayoun general did not avoid a bloodbath quite the contrary. giving the possibility for israelis to get in gave the latter the opportunity to commit other bloodbath afterward, check the news.

    also the guy did go out of his barrack and greet the Israelis. it’s not like he waved a white flag or something. The order came from fatfat i bet you. Intelligence orders have to be followed. In any case, shit will hit the fan in the following days. Very ugly stuff will be uncovered, it takes time and political protocols.

    PS: can somebody make this “diaspora” get off of me? do i know him? if yes let him introduce himself as something less eloquent than a “diaspora”. Also please someone tell him that i don’t want to go backwards three years.

  10. Well, bech, I agree and disagree. On the one hand, it seems silly to me to hang this general out to dry, because he undoubtedly had no orders to engage the IDF … So I have to wonder what he should have done … ? Obviously, I am not sure anyone knows the precise details of what transpired, but I sufficed to say that any ISF/LAF/police in southern Lebanon have been put in a terribly awkward position. I would agree that with you (and mssr. smeha) that the fault lies with the government, not the commanders in the field …

    As for spies, well I need more documentary evidence about these reports. And most countries do in fact jail and try spies and that seems to me the most preferable option, morally and politically. Hizb should not be acting extrajudicially against collaborators in Lebanon, unless circumstances require (in flagrante delicto, or red-handed) … I am sure this is Hizb’s position as well, so we need to know more about the precise details and avoid allegations and incriminations by either side without sufficient proof …

    It seems to me that Israel would clearly like to see increased hostility between the GOL/the Army and Hizbullah … So it is important that cool heads prevail and not get caught up in unsubstantiated reports that only serve Israel’s interests in Lebanon … Secondly, it is also quite clear that the Syrians will create and use such reports to target its enemies in Lebanon …

    I dont pretend to know the details, so perhaps I should not speak on this issue, but it seems important that all parties resist the temptations offered by those who would like to see Lebanese on Lebanese violence …

    I will just say this, Hizbullah should turn over any and all collaborators to the state whereever humanly possible, and should not play this Israeli or Syrian game …

  11. >>> Since do we give trials to spies? no nation in the history of the world have ever done this in a time of war

    Well Bech supposing what u say is true, it is our duty as citizens to set minimal standards by remembering those who were killed summarily and ask abuot them. Who are they? How can you be sure they were all spies? What do you know about them?

    And no, war is not an excuse to commit all the killings. And no, all spies are not summarily shot at times of war. They can be imprisoned, have a trial and then get shot.

    What worries me more is the fact we focus on what journalists focus.

    On the one hand you have 16 people killed — no one talked about them, they remain unnoticed and invisible

    On the other you have a picture of an officer offering tea to Israeli soldiers.

    Because the press has judged the Marjayoun incident was more important we comment on it.

    It is in my opinion crucial for our critical reading of events, to be alert about all the raw news we get and then decide which one is more important.

  12. Sorry my mistake friends. first of all fatfat is indeed minister of interior, second, no one should be killed under any charge.

    However, please provide with the link that shows that “spies” were killed by Hezbollah. for now the general of marjayoun is still alive. We’re still investigating if he received orders from a minister.

    For the rest i agree with the above made comments. But you have to understand that there is a big battle being waged inside Lebanon right now, much bigger than the Israeli-Lebanese one.

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